30. Listener questions: Handling a promotion with GTD, paper based systems and OneNote

Transcript

Automatically transcribed and lightly edited. Timestamps omitted for readability.

Morten: Welcome to another episode of the Getting Things Done podcast from GTD Nordic. I'm Morten Ødreivik, and I'm here as always with my friend and colleague Lars Schjøtzke-Henriksen. Hello, Lars.

Lars: Hi, Morten. Happy to be back and looking forward to doing another episode of our podcast. If you're new to this podcast, our goal is to support you in using Getting Things Done, getting the most out of the methodology, perhaps providing some new aspects to you so you can become an even better GTDer, better at staying present with whatever you're doing at work or at home. And we really hope that you find these episodes valuable regardless of how experienced you are with GTD. And if you are new to GTD or want a refresher, we suggest to go back and listen through episodes 1 through 6. Of this podcast.

Morten: Yes, and today, Lars, we have listener questions. We have 3 questions from 2 listeners.

Lars: That is correct. We have picked out a couple of the questions that have been sent to us. So first of all, thank you for those of you who are sending your questions to us. We really appreciate it and love picking them up in, in some of these episodes. We have today from, from 2 people One from Michael in Germany and also from Ingrid in Australia. So we'll start a bit closer to where we are based. We'll start with, with Michael from Germany, and he sent us an email a while back where he said, I got a job promotion within my recent company. I will change from a staff position in the administration to the executive management next year. Therefore, my tasks and my field of action will change a lot. I surely will use the ideas of GTD to both organize my debriefing and the handover to my replacement, as well as to gain an overview of the tasks and goals in my new position. Still, I would be very interested to hear from you guys how you would deal with the job change and using GTD to make that smooth and effective. That was from Michael in Germany. What would you say to Michael's question, Morten?

Morten: First and foremost, congratulations. And yes, you need to step it up. I remember when I started with GTD, I stumbled on GTD just as I started in a new job as a managing director for an IT consultancy here in Norway. And, you know, when you are in a new job, this is— and he has also the handover to consider. He really needs to get his game together. So to start with, what I would do if I would say if I hadn't mapped out my horizons of focus, I would at least map out my areas of responsibility for the old job and the new job. If you don't know your areas of responsibility clearly mapped out in the new job, I would talk to my new boss there and get that sorted out so you actually know what you are measured on delivering on. And then I would write them down and I would use that as the foundation of creating projects for the handover and for getting into ease myself into the new job. What would you do, Lars?

Lars: Yeah, when I saw Michael's question, I was thinking back to my former life as an IT consultant as well and just remembering how amazingly more efficient these handovers can be when you're a GTDer. You know, the projects, when you hand them over, they really give the receiving person a clear picture of what you're working on so they know exactly what's going on. Next actions will tell them where to pick up. And I completely agree with you that especially, you know, looking into the higher horizons of focus, especially the areas of focus and accountability, having those established will really give them a big helping hand in both getting the overview of what, you know, what's in the role, but also, you know, that they understand their role and they can, you know, open up their radar and know what to look for and catch these new things that should land on their plate going forward. So really, really gaining an understanding of that new job. And as you say, you know, especially as he will be transitioning to the executive management team, there will surely be some higher horizon things to look into. I'm appreciating this more and more these days, coaching more and more people in these higher horizons. And it's so much fun to, to really dig into those, see what you find in there, both getting a clear view of these areas of focus, but also, you know, really thinking through these things and really asking why. There's so many more things. Why are we doing this? Where do we want to be in 1 to 2 years, 3 to 5 years? And why are we doing all this stuff? Why am I doing these things? How does this all connect together and match up? And it's just so, so interesting to spend time on. So certainly would echo your recommendation in investing the time to look into more of this.

Morten: Yes. And just one another comment is that in his situation with leaving one job and taking over a new role in a job is that you must make sure that this transition for all is the most smooth. And this is really critical time. This is a really critical time for him to make sure he has captured all his projects. And that's why I mentioned the areas of responsibility. If you're not, if you don't have all your projects mapped out, all the, and have next actions on them, you can't feel good about the transition time. That's basically impossible because you will not have a clear head as of the reason because you don't have the overview and the control you need of the situation. So things will sneak into your brain again. So just make sure you map up all your projects, both in the new job and the transition out of the old job. That's mine.

Lars: Yeah. And especially that transition, I certainly remember that from a lot of, you know, IT consultant projects where I would be working with people that had maybe, maybe stayed in the same company for 10, 15 years and they would have, you know, been promoted a number of times, but they would sort of still be hanging on to parts of the job that they had then left or parts of those positions that they had left. So really making it a clear cut and saying, I am no longer responsible for this. Obviously, he will have some experience that the new person can maybe draw on because he's staying in the same company, but really being clear on handing over these areas of responsibility to someone else. Because that can be difficult both for the receiving end because people will still be asking for, hey, we did this differently with Michael, how are we now doing this in another way? Things like that. So really, really being aware that this is also valuable, I think.

Morten: Yeah, I'm actually coaching a client now who has just transitioned into a new job and he's in that squeeze where the new person don't feel, you know, confident yet in his new role and is leaning on him all the time to get his pick his brain. And at some point that had to stop.

Lars: And.

Morten: You know, that if you, It is, of course, okay to give a helping hand to someone until one feels more or less comfortable. But at some point in time, the new person must take responsibility and say— you can say bye-bye to that old project called the old job.

Lars: So, yeah. And just also, you know, the other thing I noted down was really to, you know, really enjoy taking on that new role when you have GTD, because it really is a pleasure to to take on a new role where you have the tools and ways to get that overview and get things set up. I, again, did this a lot in my previous life as a consultant. So, got a new client, they would maybe give you a new notebook and off you go. So, setting up your system in whatever is available on that notebook is slowly established, the lists you need, you know, likely need new agenda lists for that role maybe, and then really move forward using it to work on the right things, using it to effectively lead those meetings that you will now be working with, etc. So it's really— I, uh, I, in some sense, kind of, kind of miss that because that really was a fun way to, to, you know, start somewhere new and then picking up and really outlining the perfect system for that role.

Morten: Yeah. And another final tip for me would be then when you, when you are going into that new role and in the old job, leaving that old job, use the natural planning model to help your boss explain the new job to you. What's the desire? And sorry, what's the purpose of this? What's the, you know, what does wild success look like in this area of responsibility or in this particular project? That will help you understand what does success look like in your new boss's brain, but you can also use this with your, you know, the old job, handing it over to someone where you can use the same thinking to hand the project over in a beautiful manner. So the person who takes over your role actually understands what's expected.

Lars: Yeah. Great. So I think we covered a few aspects, and I hope, Michael, that we gave you some food for thought, and that it's been a while since you said it. So I'm wondering whether you've already transitioned, but hopefully this was helpful in making that transition. The other question, or the other person who sent in questions, was Ingrid from Australia. And she wrote, firstly, thanks for your podcast. I learned something valuable from each episode and always find something new when I listen again to old episodes. I also really enjoy the Nordic accents. We don't hear enough of them here in Australia. So I'm happy to hear that because I don't think we'll have much luck in changing those. So happy that you, you appreciate them.

Morten: Are you sure of this?

Lars: She goes on to say, you mentioned recently that you are interested in presenting top tips. I have two systems as I prefer a paper-based system at home to feel like I'm getting a break from the computer in my time off, but I'm using OneNote for my work commitments. I'd love to hear how to effectively use OneNote, but also how to effectively use a good paper-based system without constantly rewriting things. And in parentheses, she's noting all the Planner videos on YouTube involve constantly rewriting information. Thank goodness for checklists. Kind regards and stay safe in these uncertain times. Ingrid from Australia. How would you respond to Ingrid, Morten?

Morten: Well, if you start with the paper-based systems first, I'm still avidly coaching people who prefer paper-based systems. And my suggestion to you, Ingrid, is that if you choose the paper-based, it must be either because you love paper or because you don't like the digital tools. Because you could choose another digital tool, you know, that's not OneNote, or just divide it into a systematic way. I'm sure Lars will touch upon this when we go to to OneNote. He's the expert of this here, or the more expert than me, to make sure you don't see everything at the same time. Because that's, that's preferably— or a lot of people I talk to who want to have two different systems because they don't want to see their work-related stuff mixed in with their personal stuff. And, and that is possible to, to arrange OneNote like this, that you don't see your work related at all. This is possible. But that said is that a lot of people who choose paper-based systems are choosing it because of the constant rewriting, because the constant rewriting makes you reflect upon every time you write something, you get time to, you know, it takes maybe 10 seconds, 15, 20 seconds to write on something new, and then you get to reflect upon this again. Is this really important to me? Reconsidering things. And I remember back in 2010, I was attending David Allen's Making It All Work seminar in London. And I sat at the same table as a CEO of a large, and I mean really large European company you all heard of, who told me that he, and he was in his 30s, and he had paper-based system. And I kind of like, because I was then totally digital head and didn't understand the depths of GTD. And I asked him, why on earth would you use— you're a young person, why do you use a paper-based system? He says, because I lead a company, I need to make sure that the judgment calls I make are the best for the company. And I have to rethink everything often when I use a paper-based system. And the slowness of this thinking, slowness of paper, helps me do that and make the best judgment calls for what we concentrate on in the company. And I kind of like that a lot. And so there are— I'm not sure for Ingrid, but there are, of course, if you have an iPad, or it's possible to copy-paste things that you actually written in a notebook in in an iPad. There are, you know, note-taking apps on iPads. So if you like the, the, the, the feeling of writing with a pen, that's possibly an alternative for, for her. What would you tell her.

Lars: Lars? Well, I, I can certainly recognize what, what you're saying, and, and really, I can understand the wish to disconnect even more when you're not at work. So, so paper can be a really good option for some, but as you said already, there will be a lot of rewriting. And I think exactly that angle of appreciating this, to actually like to rewrite it, forcing you to be even more aware, to be even more critical on what you put on your list. I think that's actually— yeah, exactly. Maybe that's actually a benefit for some people. So it will certainly be some work to rewrite it. But on the other hand, maybe that's actually a good part of the work. And like you said, you know, some people also do a hybrid version. You can do the iPad version. I also know some people that actually maintain these lists in OneNote. They will print them in the beginning of the week. They will work from them during their week, and when they have their weekly review or at the end of the week, they will update the stuff that has happened back into their digital system in OneNote and then repeat that starting next week. So, so what I've heard from them is, is the ability to focus is much more easy when they only sit there with the list of next actions at the computer, but they have that on paper. They will run through that. They will, you know, point their pen at whatever they want to dive into and then, yeah, work on that. And I also heard that, you know, clients really appreciate, for example, when you show up with just paper and have a clear agenda in the meeting, things that they need to have clarified before they can move forward. And, you know, the notebook can stay there in the bag if you need to open it and find something, but otherwise it's out of sight and you can really give those attention, your full attention to those clients. So, that could also be one way to go for it. As for using OneNote, I've used OneNote for several years now, probably 5 years ago and 3 years before that, and was very happy with it. I really liked it as a system. You can share it if you want to. It's, I think what's really key is the flexibility that it offers. So, you can create your lists, you can create your tables, you can put in pictures, and you can place them anywhere in the pages that you prefer. I have some PDFs, for example, that I used to put in there, and it would just, you know, print the PDF and show it on the page rather than just having a link to a file. On the other hand, what I got a bit tired of was the requirement to clean up. Again, this could also be seen as a positive because it will make it more clear for you what you might have completed during the week since your last weekly review, maybe. But, you know, checking off a checkbox in OneNote does not make it disappear, so you would have to go back and then and clean them, clean them out. So again, if you like that, then OneNote is a good system. If you don't, then maybe that would be a bit tiresome as it became for me. What I would note is to be careful about organizing, because I often, at least that's what I often see, is that I find organized people are attracted to OneNote because again, it has this flexibility that they can really set things up the way that they want. I just saw this on our Facebook forum as well, some screenshots with examples from, from people the other day where the organization would be that they would have the project and the next action just beside it. And obviously that gives them a good overview of, you know, what's the project, what's the next action. But when you want to work, then, then certainly a clear list of next actions is what you want to feed your brain and not having to, to rethink all these things, have to run through all projects and next action look through everything to find what the right thing is to do. So be careful how you organize, and of course there is an official OneNote setup guide as well that's available in the shops. And lastly, I still use it for support material. I still use it as our shared digital archive and also for my GTD-related archive. And especially, I think, for sure, you know, for the support material, it's really beneficial to have this flexibility for me. You know, let's say I want to get an overview of all the Christmas presents to buy. Often the availability in systems like Outlook, like Todoist, other systems will be text-based. And it's nice in OneNote to be able to create a quick table where I can write who needs, you know, who should I get Christmas presents for, who's responsible if we have this as a shared list, do we have any ideas, what's the status, have we bought it, etc. So it really has that flexibility for me to work from and getting that overview. So I still use OneNote for sure. And I'm very happy with it.

Morten: It is of course okay to split your system in two halves and, you know, have a distraction-free paper-based channel, but it could also for her to— an option could be to go for an alternative app on her phone, like Things is a good one, Microsoft To Do without any, you know, you don't have The Microsoft To Do can work as a standalone app for your system on your phone only. That could be used for private stuff, so you don't have to rewrite any. Then she will have two separate systems, but then she will have the— a phone is never a distraction-free zone, so paper is a lot less distraction. But an alternative could be to clear your first screen for for anything that yells at you, turn off all the notifications, all the red dots on all the programs you use or the apps you use on the first page, and then just put things there so when you open your phone, not pulled into— I don't know if you ever had this, dear listener, if you ever had opened your phone and had a clear idea what you wanted to do when opening the phone and then end up doing something something completely different because you got distracted, then you know what I mean. So if you could create a distraction-free front page to the first page of your phone that you see, don't have any, you know, like you can have— you have to decide if, for instance, if you want to have lost calls, that's of course a possibility, but, um, and SMS or whatever you want to have as notifications, but it should be as distraction-free as possible and give you free access to your dumping place for wherever you dump your captured things into. But it's not as distraction-free as paper, but again, it's portable and with you. And yeah, that's my two cents for this.

Lars: Yeah. So thanks again to both listener questions. And if you have any questions, be sure to send them to podcast@gtdnordic.dk. You have that in the show notes as well, so please keep those coming, coming, and we'll pick them up in, in future episodes.

Morten: And I just wanted to, if I can stop you for 2 seconds, since, and because people, you mentioned the OneNote setup guide. This is official guides from the David Allen Company. They are available at gettingthingsdone.com as downloadable PDFs. And if you're in Norway and Denmark, you go to gtdnordic.dk and produktivnordige.no. We have webshops for downloading these, all the different setup guides from the David Allen Company. It costs you a couple of bucks, but it's an investment, I guess.

Lars: And I think it's really— I've heard from others as well that really, you know, So when you're setting this up, it's really well worth it trying to work off these best practices rather than trying to reinvent it when you start off with GTD. I've heard that from a lot of Danish GTDers that they really got a lot of benefit from that. Yeah.

Morten: And all of them have a little repetition of what is GTD and what's best practices in the beginning there. So that helps also.

Lars: So yeah. So to find your way there, you can go via gtdnordic.com. You'll find the way to the Danish, the Norwegian, the Swedish, the Finnish, the Icelandic maybe. I don't know if it's there or soon coming to gtdnordic.com. And on each of those country websites, you will find links to our Facebook groups. You'll find all the news that we have written about GTD aspects in there, the newsletter, all the courses. And as mentioned in previous episodes, really the virtual offerings are all there also. And if you're outside the Nordics, gettingthingsdone.com is a good place to start to find your local partner. And as mentioned, we really hope that you find this episode valuable. If you do, it really helps us if you go to iTunes, rate the podcast there, or of course share it with a colleague that you think might benefit from, from listening to this episode. So thanks for that.

Morten: Good. Thank you everybody for listening, and I hope we'll Lars, is that we give you some value this episode also. And as Lars also said, please keep the questions coming. We love them, we love to answer them, we love to reflect upon them, and we give you the best answers we can. So until next time, stay safe and stay productive. Bye-bye, everyone.

Lars: Are you still there, man?

Morten: Yes, I am. I muted myself, of course. No, I was going to say that, um, for, for Ingrid, she is.