Episode 115 of the Getting Things Done® podcast. Listen above, or read the full transcript below.
Transcript
Automatically transcribed and lightly edited. Timestamps omitted for readability.
Morten: Hi, and welcome to another episode of the Getting Things Done podcast from Vital Learning. I am Morten Dreveg, and I am here as always with my good friend and colleague Lars Rothschild Henriksen. Privet, Lars. Privet, Morten.
Lars: Good to be here as always, and it's always good to be with our listeners and viewers out there. We always start off with a quick reminder of the purpose of the podcast, which is to help you learn GTD or become even better GTDers. We hope that today's episode supports you in that. If you are new to GTD, we always recommend you go back and find the audio versions of episodes 1 through 6 to get an introduction to the basics of GTD, the 5 steps. Today's episode number is number 115, and today's episode title will sound familiar. I have too much to do too.
Morten: Exactly. And this time it is me. And, uh, we will, uh, have a deep dive in when I had too much to do earlier this summer. And, um, but we wanted to touch upon the summer camp as well. So why don't we start there, Lars? Is that a good idea?
Lars: Absolutely. Yeah, because we did.
Morten: We're still right.
Lars: Yeah, exactly. So it's worth maybe noting that we are recording this about 8 days after the summer camp. So this is released after summer, but we're recording it then. So we are still high from the summer camp this year, which was again in Denmark, June 15th to 16th. You've heard us say this many times in the podcast. So you probably already knew that. But it was a lot of fun. 60 people from 13 countries. I think we counted this year from the, you know, America, South, North, Hong Kong. And nearby Europe. So much fun. Nicest people. So many happy smiling faces. It was a lot of fun.
Morten: I had a moment when we started the summer camp, when you asked people, I think it was you, wasn't it, who asked people to get up, or was that Jens? I don't remember. It was you. Okay. So, so you got, you got the 2020, um, summer camp people to get up and then 2021, 22, 23. And then, and that, that when that happened, that was so cool. That was, you could, you could smell the, the, the, the, the enthusiasm for this camp and you can kind of, I felt it physically. This is going to be the best ever. It was.
Lars: Yeah, it really was so nice to How many people come back and, you know, the, yeah, you recognize the faces and it's, it really is becoming a fantastic community event. It really is.
Morten: Yeah. Yeah. And the feeling of, you know, community is one thing, but the feedback I got, at least for the value of this for people coming, was very high. People loved it. And And it is, uh, it is fun meeting people who think same like you, who thinks getting things done is cool and good for me. And I want to get better. And GTGers are the nicest people. End of story.
Lars: Yeah, really are. They really are. It was a lot of fun to see. I think there was a lot of, you know, the— I really liked to see one of the things I like to see with this year was that, you know, we are growing. So we were 60 people this year as opposed to, I think, around 40 last year. But there was still a lot of focus on the Buddy aspects. People were really looking for that. And I've seen posts about this as well in the Facebook group that we have for Summer Camp participants or in our Danish forum for the community. It's just so nice to see that people are really focusing on this and sharing how much value it has given them. So that was one aspect of the summer camp this year that I really liked.
Morten: Me too. And I remember talking to one of the guys, a Norwegian, he talked to— well, last time I was there, I got a GTD buddy in the US and they came back and it was, you know, that when you— I don't know how they make their— because they do weekly review together, I think, and how they do that, I don't know, but they are doing it and they're keeping each other accountable across the Atlantic, which is So cool. So cool.
Lars: Very impressive.
Morten: Yeah. And one thing I liked this year was it was more time for mingling, for talking. This is highly appreciated because getting to know people and connect is really, really good. So, well, if you were there, thank you.
Lars: Yes. Really big thank you. Thank you, everyone presenting. Thank you to our live coaching Client, you know who you are, who was bold and brave to, to stand there on stage and show their system. And, you know, uh, Thais from Brazil sharing the thoughts behind compassionate productivity, I thought that was really interesting as well. Um, the group discussions were fun to be a part of as well, as much as I could, at least, uh, from my perspective, about the challenges in working together. Um, David and Ed were on on separate occasions, was a lot of fun. You were on as well, Morten, during Horizons of Focus together. And yeah, there were so many, so many good things. Ståler with his advanced high-tech Microsoft deep dive, that was really fantastic with, you know, seeing how Copilot will help hopefully with our lists and summaries of meetings and all that going forward. Very interesting stuff. And yeah, fantastic weekend. And not to forget the GTD board game that Torbjørn, one of the Danish trainers, came with as well. That was played, I think, on all 3 days, or at least, at least 2 days, where you would, you know, do a weekly review. And there were 2-minute actions, and there were, I think, neurons or something. I didn't get to play it, but I was very fascinated by it. So hopefully, hopefully we'll get, get to provide a link to that at some point in the future where people can buy it.
Morten: Yes, indeed. And if you were not there, you know what to do next year. Same week, we think, but details will follow at gtdsummercamp.com. To come. So, and we will of course tell you here in the podcast. Are you ready to return to today's topic, or do you have something else you'd like to mention?
Lars: Let us do that. We'll talk more about the summer camp next. Again, we have the evaluations being sent today, I think, as we record this. So we'll be able to talk more about what value it added for people. But what I've seen so far is just, again, reiterating Hans's message from last year. I think I found my tribe. I've heard multiple people use that phrase. So we may have to trademark that as well and give credit to Hans every time, of course. But no, let's move on to the next topic.
Morten: Yeah. Well, this is, you know, the two alludes to that there's someone before me who had too much to do. And that was you, Loris. Maybe we could start just briefly what happened with you?
Lars: How's it going now? Is it going better? Yeah, it is going better now, but that is because we are approaching summer. It is to some extent my ability to be able to block out and decide how to use my calendar. But it is also because there's just not that much going on in July. That's just, you know, the nature of our business. So there won't be people aren't doing seminars because they're on vacations or summer breaks. And of course, I've tried to take some paternity leave as well. We had some things scheduled. As of this recording, we were on a small island this weekend called Fårö, which has 457 inhabitants. So we took some time for that as well. So I'm making sure that we balance all of these things out. It's getting to the right place now. I think I have the amount of work that I would expect to have. And as always, always there are some things that, oh, I really want to get that done. So that's, I think that is how, and that is my sort of default mode. So we're approaching that and I'm fine with that. And let's see if I can schedule in some more room in the second half of the year to make sure that we can stay at this level. I think that'll be doable.
Morten: Can I ask you, Lars, how did you notice that you had too much to do? Hmm. That is a good question. When did the coin drop?
Lars: I don't know if there's one specific thing that I notice. I know from, I know from, you know, the personal life that it's when we try to plan something, but we just aren't able to plan something. Like we, we try the, the calendar just does not leave enough room and we get, you know, we, we get overbooked and we won't be able to, you know, let's say we wanna meet some friends from, for dinner. We just have to look too far into the future. I have some, just two friends from olden days that I wanna meet with and we have to look 6 months into the calendar before we can just go out for a beer. I mean, it's crazy. So that is one indicator and I.
Morten: Think there's Danish spontaneity for you.
Lars: Yeah. Yeah. So that's one and there are several. I think it's just when there are too many things on my should-do pretty soon list. I think that's also an indicator. Is there one for you?
Morten: Well, it is. Yeah, what I have, when I, I will just do a recap first and then we can dive into because I'm thinking that there is something you can physically feel when you get too much to do. And I got to that point. So that will be the cliffhanger. But just to give you the, the, you know, some of my background for this is that back in the day, in around 1999-2000, I, I had a burnout. And that was before I met GTD. The book was released 2001. So sorry, David, you were a little late to the game, at least for me. I know that I would not get this, and I have proof because I avoided a burnout again now because I had Getting Things Done. And I just want to go back to that time just to give you, to the listeners, we actually do have a podcast episode about this somewhere in our catalog. So go back and look for burnout and you can find my story in more detail. But just a broad overview is that I changed too many things at the same time and I had too much external stress. So I moved 3 or 4 times in a very short time. I got divorced in the same moment as I— then we had at work, there was some big sharks trying to eat us. They tried at least to eat our lunch. It was very stressful at work. And you feel the feeling of not being able to meet people's and yourself, your expectations and others' expectations. And that led to— and I didn't have the emotional intelligence of, you know, internal intelligence emotionally to understand that what I— the emotions I had was stress. And when the stress was there too long, it become a sickness. They become something that I couldn't, you know, I wouldn't call it control, but it is something that you experience. So the heightened level of, when I talk about it now, I can feel it. I can bring it back by my imaginations, these emotions and these negative stressors manifest themselves in your body. And that's why I'm asking you, do you have any, you know, symptoms that you can feel? And I know that when I did this back in the day, it was symptoms was that I had problem breathing because I was breathing just in top of my lungs because you can't take this. And sometimes you go You must take this deep breath for it, as you know, to refill your lungs with oxygen. And being alert all the time, feeling that you are, you know, it is a fight or flight response. So that is, do I run now? Is the feeling. And I got that this spring because you know that we've had, you know, across the board, the whole world or most of the world has a recession in the economy, and so do we. So when we get some business, you do whatever you can to make that business happen. And we suddenly had, I had 3 seminars in 4 weeks and you know, parallel with a lot of coaching at the same time that I was healing from my broken wrist. And, uh, and, and we were going to travel. I, I went to 8 different planes in the same month, and I was going to go on to other— to go to Denmark, uh, to be at the partner, uh, meeting, meeting in, in Copenhagen. And As you know, I cancelled my physical appearance there. I was there virtually instead, just to spare myself. And what I understood at some point is that I had the same symptoms, the same stressors starting to weigh on me. And I would like to just address the people out there who feel maybe I am one of those who have these stressors in me. Know that it is physically possible to feel them. And the first may be the problem with breathing. It's like you suddenly go, you must take extra air. When I do my coaching, I can see this when I meet a new client, potential client, or new client. I can see if they're stressed or not because you can observe that in their demeanor and the way they breathe. And you can hear it as well. And this is the first, probably, symptom. The second is that you don't listen to your body. I remember one of the things that I suddenly realized when I did, back in the day, I realized that I had, you know, I was stressed and I was on the verge of burnout, is that I suddenly realized that I was working long hours and suddenly I had this genuine irritation inside of me. Something was wrong, but I couldn't put my finger on it. Something was really wrong. And then I realized, well, you went to the toilet this morning, but you haven't done anything during the day. This is your body telling you, you have to go to the toilet. It's like this, this, this, stop listening to your body is not good. Of course. And it is a very typical stressor for people, or not a stressor, but a symptom, is that you stop listening to yourself. So for instance, if you are tired, you force yourself to continue. You push yourself to continue because you have to deliver. So, but if you do it too long, over too much, too long time, it will be very difficult for you to focus. You will sleep worse. You will, you know, then sleep becomes a problem. You don't sleep good. You don't. And if you then add the feeling— I didn't do that before nor now, but this I know people do this— is that they use alcohol as a way to relax. Because you can't relax. Your brain is going, do me, do me, do me, do me, do me, do me. This is, this this noise in your brain, and then you have to numb it. And some people start to drink alcohol or do drugs or whatever they need to do to relax again. And of course, that doesn't help anything because it will just blur your brain. And when you try to focus to get the things done, you can't because there are just too many. So having too much to do for too long time is not good. It will burn you out. And I don't know, have you ever felt any symptoms of that, this breathing?
Lars: No, I am aware of it. I think the breathing, yeah, maybe I've occasionally noticed that. Doesn't really resonate with me and what I know from myself or at least from others, tics near the eyes. Tics going on, things like that. I've heard from others as well to be one of the symptoms.
Morten: Yeah, tics. This involuntary movement of your, you know, close to the eyes, the eyelids, or just the muscle in your cheek making something. Yes, I've had that as well. So, but one of the things, but you slept fine, I guess.
Lars: Yeah, yeah, sleeping is always no problem. Well trained with small children.
Morten: You sleep when you can. I have 5 minutes.
Lars: Exactly.
Morten: Yeah. No, then one of the things that I, I, um, I did hear, it sounds to me that you, you've, you managed to stop, um, your too much to do. At the stage where it didn't get bad for you. But if you had continued, you probably, you could have ended in a burnout if you didn't stop. And I'm going to address some of the things that I think is some of the root causes of this. And one of the things that I think is probably the worst to shed is that you are You want to satisfy yourself and others' expectations of you. So if people expect you to do something or you expect you to do something, that, that is probably one of the things that can lead to the feeling of, well, I don't deliver, I have to work harder. And then you work harder and then you just get more and more tired. And when you get more and more tired, it's a very bad cycle because you can't make everybody happy all the time. So fear of letting people down, letting them— I don't know how Larsen, how we come across in this podcast, but I'm sure people don't have a true picture of us. It's the picture that they see through this podcast. I'm not inside your brain. I can't be, and nobody can be inside mine but me. And, but one of the things that I think you can, you can look like you're very successful, but if you have too much to do for too long and too many, too much expectations from yourself and others on what you should deliver on, you will be at some point be sick. And It is very sneaky. It's like sneaks up on you. The symptoms become a little worse every day, and every time, every day you don't take them seriously and do something about them, they add to the pile of burnout. And we, um, there is a— if I'm not a psychologist, but there are some psychologists that have created something called Dodson's Law, which is the stress law that we've, I think we shared it on the podcast before us as well.
Lars: Yeah, we have the stress curve and everything.
Morten: I think the stress curve, yeah, where the stress curve is, you stay in stress too long and you, because even, you know, I was going to say this, like even me can become have too much to do. But it is like any human. If people think that we are inhuman and can do anything, it's no, we are human. And Lars and I, we have the same problem, is that when you reach your maximum capacity of what you actually can deliver on, you know, the 5 steps of getting things done, where you can, you know, you get more of the right things done, but at the same time, when you get more things done, you want to do more things, so it adds up. And if you don't know when to stop, and that is a big problem. If you don't know, how do I know I have too much to do, then that's a problem. So, so my suggestion to anyone who feels that stress life, you can feel the symptoms that I'm talking about now, take a step back. I will tell you what I did. Back in the day, first time when I did this in 2000, I got sick leave for way too long time. It becomes very chronic and I got so sick that I couldn't get out of bed for a long time. And when I got out of bed, it was so painful to go outside to meet people, was really difficult. And don't go there. I recommend you stay away from that. Don't go there. And it is really, really negative. If you get really burned out, this is— I would not— I don't have any enemies in life, but that I know of at least. But if I had one, I would not recommend that to this person at all. I wouldn't. I don't. It is really, really not a good place to be. But to get out of it, it has to do with, well, I use my Horizon to Focus, where it says that I take care of me. That's the first, you know, top line. I take care of me, making sure that I am healthy, I sleep well, I exercise as much as I think I shall, and I, you know, I protect myself. But when I understood that, hmm, you're not doing that now, that is the first instigator of of doing something about it. So making sure that you have written down that you are the most important person in your life, you should, because you are. If you do that, you understand that nobody is helped by the fact that you get burned out or that you're burning yourself out. Nobody. Not you, not the people around you, not your boss, not your company. If you get sick, that's really bad for all parties involved. So, so taking that higher horizon look at myself was— and I suggested you do the same— is, is the first step. And then just take a little step back from, you know, create a space of a few hours and step back and look at your calendar, look at your lists, and ask yourself, what can I shed now, that I should not do now. That's not— it may be urgent, it may be important, but I am not going to do that now. So for me, it was the first step was to realize this, and second step was to inform you, Lars, and the other partners in the group that I am now on the verge of going back to something I don't want to go back to. I have to take this seriously. I can't come to Denmark. I'm sorry. And, um, and just realizing that and telling you that, that helps. Tell the people around you, I am on the verge of burning out now. I feel I have some symptoms I have to take seriously. Um, that, that is step number one. And the second idea would be to, to, uh, then just look at, you know, everything that can go, just Take it out and create some extra space for you. The problem with this is that when you start taking space, your whole body wants to start doing, ticking things off. Your whole body wants to say, let me do something, let me do something, let me do something. Because if you're not doing something, you feel you will be even more behind. I don't know if that makes sense to you. Absolutely.
Lars: Yeah.
Morten: So the more behind you get, the more behind you get. But the idea is then when you, even if it is little on your lists and you don't have a lot on your calendar, still your whole body wants to continue doing. And then the idea is that then you really have to just force yourself to do things that is not ticking off something on your list or doing something, just rest. Just don't do anything. Read a book, try, look in binge-watch a Netflix series or something. Just take time for you and take time to take a step back.
Lars: Yeah, I can really recognize that also with, you know, in my mind, I see that as momentum and it's really difficult to change that. That is also why even though, let's say, my calendar up until 2 weeks ago was very busy, it certainly takes some time to actually getting used to the new pace and perhaps there's tiredness involved or perhaps there'll be other other physical signs. It's also why I, whenever possible, try to have a longer summer break because I really do find that there's a difference. So in Denmark, I know we are very lucky to have a lot of people have 3 consecutive weeks of vacation at the summertime. And for me, it seems to be the case that after, from weeks, at the end of the 2 weeks, that 3rd week is just different somehow. There's just more. You're sort of the momentum is down to vacation level. At least that's— I don't know if that will be the same for every year, but at least that's what I've seen in previous years, that there seems to be something that happens when we, for me at least, take 2 weeks off. And then there's some more calm, and it's just a different type of break. So whoever can do that, I hope you're able to, because I do think that matters.
Morten: It does. And then just to make sure that you are not Letting things bleed in. If you're really taking a vacation, then really take a vacation. Some of the things that I've seen that I've done before is that I don't take real vacation. I just take partial vacation. I'm actually easing into my vacation as we record this. And I am going to go off. I'm going to have a VIP list of some, some clients that I would like to receive email from. The rest I will not. I will go off, off campus. You will not find me unless you know my phone number and call me or send me an SMS or being by my VIP list on email. And just to make sure that my resting time is really resting time. And I will do physical things. I will not stop working, but I will not work with the office work. I will not do anything company-wise. I will, you know, we have a place that we are trying to fix up, vacation place, and we're going to continue doing that. I'm going to build a new terrace, a part of a new terrace this summer, and I will continue painting, and that is going to be a little therapeutic to me. I don't know. Do you do something, Lars, when you do vacation, or you have small children?
Lars: Absolutely. Yeah.
Morten: Very much doing something.
Lars: No, so that's the, that's a good thing that the, so we have 3 boys, uh, one being 4 months at the time of this recording, the others are 6 and 8. So the 6 and 8, uh, 6 and 9 soon are very, you know, um, they, they always play together. So they're frequently able to, to do their own thing. So we can, we can certainly join their, their games, whatever they're doing. But oftentimes we will have, I will have time to do some, some work around the garden. And that is really how we relax. That's how we enjoy relaxing. I know. Some friends who will be able to go to, you know, Egypt and sit by the pool for a week and just read books and go for a swim. And that is— I could do that for short amounts of time. We have to do something. Yeah, it's just— it does not resonate well with me. It just doesn't. Trigger me. Just, I don't, I don't enjoy it that much. I will sit there for an hour reading a book and then we have to go, you know, diving to see if we can see a turtle or something. That is what we'll go to.
Morten: Give me a stimulation.
Lars: Yeah. Yeah. It's so, so from that perspective, it's good to have young boys.
Morten: Yeah. Yeah. Well, well, I, I, I have I can sit still and read a book for some time, but I can't do it for a day. That's not possible because I also need— it is something we both work with our brains and, you know, the brain and fingers is what we use the most. And I think that when you are not using your brain and fingers, then you can use your body. To do something, you know, see something, do something, experience something, create something, fix something, the physical, which is good.
Lars: Yeah, love doing that.
Morten: Yeah, me too. So, um, I'm thinking that, uh, I've ended my, uh, what I wanted to talk about. It's just, I just want to Briefly recap with myself. Did I forget something? I don't think so. One of the things that I think is important for you, if you feel the symptoms, do take them seriously. If you feel, you know, this, this, this, it's like a humming in your body. It's like you can't turn it off, but it gets less if you relax. And if you get stressed, it will be that it will be continue and will be at a high pitch and you will it is like electricity in the body. That's at least one of my symptoms. So if you feel you are there, do something, please.
Lars: Yeah. No, it's a really good tip and I'm glad you shared it in this episode. It's something for me as well to become better at because I know that one of my strengths and also a weakness is that I'm very good at focusing on things, but that means that I'm also ignoring other other things. And ignoring those signs, as you say, can be really significant and have, you know, really, really big impacts. And that is something for me to train myself in as well, to become better at noticing, because I will be, you know, amazingly blind to some very obvious things for other people. And those signs might be some. So maybe I did experience some of them and didn't notice. I don't know. But I'll be sure to keep an eye out for them in the future as well.
Morten: Yeah, well, ignoring your body and ignoring the emotions that you have is very typical. And, but I'm happy that you seem to find a balance or at least a way to, to bounce back and found a strategy, because I think that's what I lacked before. But now I do have that. And combined with the horizon-focused thinking that, you know, I know I'm the most important person in my life. I have to be, because if I want to help others, I have to help me first. Which means that I, when I do something that's not good to me, I have to stop and think, are you going to continue doing that? No, maybe not. A good idea is to stop. And, um, well, at least that's what I think. So you've been warned in this episode. Do take these symptoms seriously. And there are some, some online tests. I think I I have one that is, uh, that you can test if you are on the verge of burnout. Um, you can check if you listen to this in a podcast player, then go and check the— or in on YouTube, you will find it in the show notes. If you found that link, I will— we will paste that link into the show notes so that you can take that test.
Lars: Um, yeah, and if you were looking for the burnout episode, that's episode number 49.
Morten: Okay, Burnout Episode 49. So I hope that this episode has found you well and that you are now, you know, getting ready for a hectic autumn and that make sure that you take care of you.
Lars: So, yeah. And one last thing to note from my end before we wrap up. So as you were now, you just mentioned test. And I was just, you know, one thing that has been on my mind lately was this, this new product that we are introducing from, from Core Strengths called SDI 2.0. So the— that is so cool. Yeah, it is very cool. It is. I've been, you know, showing it to so many people. So it's very briefly, and I hope I'm describing this correctly, a test to describe how you improve the relationships that you have with others, describing yourself, knowing your strengths, knowing your overdone strengths, not weaknesses. Knowing how, you know, what are your motives, how you react in conflict. I've learned, you know, so much about myself with this. And I just, I've shown it, you know, it's not, not 2 hours ago in the last trainer meeting that we had that I showed, okay, so if I'm going into a meeting with Morten, how do I communicate with Morten when things are going well, if things are not going well? It's, it's very cool. We'll have to deep dive into that at some other point. But, but the thing that— no, go ahead.
Morten: No, I was going to say that one of the things that I really like is that after you finished taking that SDI 2, you can compare yourself with colleagues and friends if you've given them permission. So, and we are doing that in the Nordic region for all the trainers. And I've looked at some of the people I really know well, like Espen, you, Jukka, and Martin, and just compared people with me. And I've, or at least my my thinking on how you are as a person, you know, it resonates because I know you fairly well. And I think, yeah, this is Lars. So don't do this, do that. So, but it is a very good tool if you're leading a team or if you are in, you know, with your family. If you want to communicate better, it's a very powerful tool. So sorry, I cut you.
Lars: Yeah. Now, the, the, what I wanted to highlight was, well, first of all, what motivates me. I am motivated by developing, I'll try that again. I am motivated by developing self-sufficiency in self and others. So I just thought that was a very, you know, spot on motivation to have as a, as a trainer. Now, what I wanted to mention was just as, as a, my, my overdone things. So, so what perhaps sometimes hinders my productivity as well. If we take it back to the GCD perspective, my number one is to be too analytical, obsessed, that I have an almost insatiable curiosity, need to understand how things work and why. And when they don't make logical sense to me, I just freeze. So that's one. The second one was methodical or rigid. So, like to keep things in order, but sometimes that just becomes too much, too rigid. The third one was why I wanted to get to this. Third one is devoted or subservient. You can believe so strongly in a person or a cause that you put it above yourself. If you've even been accused, if you've ever been accused of putting another person on a pedestal or giving too much in service of a cause, it may be because your devotion is coming on too strong. So it was just, you know, it just reminded me when you said that. And part of it may be our our passion for helping others as well, that sometimes this makes us blind and that can show up in our line of work or in any other line of work. It really doesn't have to be just us. So just wanted to add that to the mix as well.
Morten: Yeah. And it could lead you then to the burnout path if you want to make the connection. So, so, yeah.
Lars: So passionate about helping others that we then forget to help ourselves.
Morten: Yes. That's what we should not do.
Lars: Yes.
Morten: Well, I hope that you, the listener and viewer, understands that Lars and I, we are human beings with a lot of flaws, but we love what we teach and we would like to give it to you.
Lars: A lot of flaws. That was a high number.
Morten: Yeah, but we do. We have a lot of flaws. We are humans. All humans are flawed. But we are here creating this podcast to help others maybe not fall in the same pitfalls we've fallen into or not doing the same mistakes as we've done before. And I genuinely hope that we are helping people out there. And if you do find this helpful, please feel free to connect with Lars and me at LinkedIn, because if you want to help us a little, that would be very beneficial if you start following us or just send us a connection. Request, just write GDD or GDD Podcast or anything that you find beneficial as a, you know, a message, and we will add you. And we share a lot of the things that we do professionally there at LinkedIn, and probably it will give you some value. At the same time, if you see something that we posted, if you like that, that helps us spread the message to others. So feel free to follow us or connect with us at LinkedIn. So now, Lars, it's your turn. Take us out.
Lars: No, but I think you gave the, the good take us out plug, because I don't have a gtdsommercamp.com thing to point to yet. We have some ideas, as you already mentioned, as to when it will take place, but as of this recording, we don't have anything set in stone yet. But Who knows, maybe there's already something there. So perhaps go and check gtdsommercamp.com to see if there are any news about the 2025 GTD Summer Camp. All I know is that it's going to be great. A lot of nice people, room for more. So we'd love for you to join us, but we'll make sure to, to mention the dates as soon as they are fixed. And the other reminder that we normally give is to head on over to vitallearning.eu. That is where you'll find links to all of the country websites in each of the countries that operate under the Vital Learning Group. And you'll find information about GTD coaching, speeches, seminars, everything within GTD, Crucial Conversations, etc. So you'll find all that there on vitallearning.eu. And if you are outside the countries that we operate in, then be sure to head on over to cruciallearning.com to find your local partners.
Morten: Indeed. And if you are in a country where Crucial Learning does not operate, then it's gettingthingsdone.com would be a good idea to go to. So, yeah. And now it is my great pleasure to do what I often do, is to say some words at the end. You've heard me several times saying a exactly the same thing, but I think it is, it is a good one. Until next time, stay safe and stay productive. Bye-bye.
Lars: Bye everyone.
